Surface Mount DIY

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Would you be interested in surface mount DIY modules?

Yeah, buddy!
55
71%
I don't think so, pal.
22
29%
 
Total votes: 77

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executiveBlaster
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Surface Mount DIY

Post by executiveBlaster »

Hey folks!

I've been playing with some fun designs recently, some of which might be great DIY projects for the lot of ya. They are almost all surface mount parts, though, and I know that's not something everyone is down with. I know some projects have surface mount parts in them already, but I just wanted to gauge how into it the community is.

A very economical VCO, SVF, a VC ADSR, the Super PH01 (http://www.supersynthesis.com/pages/ph01) & PH01II knob recorders, and S&H are all modules I had in mind. Using 0805 resistors and caps, and SOIC chips, they're all easily done by hand. I'm even a pretty shaky fellow, and it works out fine for me.

Is this something you guys would be interested in? The only extra tools that surface mount DIY would required are tweezers and a flux pen, both of which are affordable and available at mouser, and you don't even really need the flux pen (though it helps!)

I'd definitely make a video detailing how I go about it, too, so no one would be in the dark.

So, whatd'ya think?
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Carl Hungus
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Post by Carl Hungus »

If you're willing to do some hand holding, I'd love to learn how to build SM modules.
But perhaps this kind of thing isn't for beginners, however eager they are...
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raisinbag
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Post by raisinbag »

Hey super glad to see you back in action! Wow knob recorder sounds cool! I have done a little smd and am not at all opposed to it. My ply prob is that I don't have many parts in my stash so I have to get project specific parts, but I there are more and more DIY smd stuff then it is an excuse to have usual resisters and caps in my bin. Ill buy some, 1-to add to my racks but also to practice and get better at the smd thing.
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heapish
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Post by heapish »

I'd love to learn. Got any pointers and or mini kits to try out?

Dont think I'd dare do a project with SM stuff yet.
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executiveBlaster
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Post by executiveBlaster »

a mini-kit or smd primer kit could be rad! do something really easy and simple to get people's feet wet.

@raisinbag one good thing about surface mount is the components are mega cheap!

@carl hungus (nice name! hehe) I'd definitely be down for some hand holding, of course. I'll make a video and some pdf documentation and would be available for any questions.

I recently taught an electronics illiterate pal of mine the smd basics, and he was able to get all the way through my VCO without any mishaps, so I think it would probably benefit noobs to learn how to solder surface mount packages along side through hole.
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sduck
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Post by sduck »

No sir. Not interested if there's any more than the few parts that are only available in smt. If any of your stuff was super-whiz-bang-flashy-new stuff that was super cool and not available in any other form, maybe I'd be tempted, but only if it still adhered to the just-a-few smd parts rule. I've done way more smt stuff than I care for, and find that in my case I can place and solder 20 through hole resistors much faster than I can do the same in smt. But... there are plenty of people who like the stuff, and can probably deal with it better than I can, so don't let my opinion hold you back!
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diablojoy
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Post by diablojoy »

At SOIC and 0805 levels i prefer SMD and wish that it were more popular
its cheaper , faster to populate and board design can be smaller and easier.
but like raisinbag would need to build up my parts bins to cover
I have some but not enough yet.
It probably wont happen today but if it does it definitely wont go smoothly.
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Nantonos
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Post by Nantonos »

Looking at old part availability, new part form factors and availability - its clear that the question is not if SDIY moves to surface mount, but when. This is probably clearer with ADC and DAC chips, (look at the selection and prices for 16bit DACs, then look at what changes if you select DIP only) but even for opamps and OTAs the trend is there.

Especially in Eurorack, the trend towards compactness - value-per-HP and skiff-freindliness - is another driver towards SMT.
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rosch
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Post by rosch »

any tips where they are cheaper? 1000x smt 47k for example at mouser are about 53€, while i can get 1000x through hole from reichelt for 16€
what am i doing wrong?
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andrewF
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Post by andrewF »

rosch wrote:any tips where they are cheaper? 1000x smt 47k for example at mouser are about 53€, while i can get 1000x through hole from reichelt for 16€
what am i doing wrong?
I got my last reel of smd resistors off ebay
5000 10k for $14 including delivery
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Carl Hungus
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Post by Carl Hungus »

In that case, I'd be interested. Please put me on your list to contact (if that's what you're doing).
Hell, I'd even pay a premium if you decided to make a bonus video course for total noobs.
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EMwhite
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Post by EMwhite »

I don't have the eyes or patience for it. Quite happy with through hole even though it's more expensive and time consuming. I just hope the parts supply hangs in there for another 10 years!
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joshuagoran
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Post by joshuagoran »

I have a couple projects I will be starting soon with 1206 package SMD parts, and I'll say that seems like a much easier size to invite folks new to SMD into the fray...at least it's much more appealing to me, anyway, and at least it seems that the size difference wouldn't be all that significant between the two as far as board layout given that these circuits probably wouldn't be using tiny pitch microcontrollers, etc, but I don't have any direct experience there.

I voted yes, but with some hesitation, specifically with regard to the choice of 0805.

L-1 and Nonlinear Circuits projects both use some SMD but all of them I have seen are 1206 size, FWIW.
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rosch
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Post by rosch »

andrewF wrote: I got my last reel of smd resistors off ebay
5000 10k for $14 including delivery
me too, an opened wheel of about 8000 100k 1206 for maybe 5€, that's hard to beat for life time supply.
but what makes me wonder is that all speak generally of smt parts being so much cheaper, also companies. and they need to deliver full rolls to the machines to save time afaik.
or is everyone referring to ebay prices of parts of rolls?

i was about to order the smt for the various nonlinear circuits projects from reichelt but was surprised that the few parts i need would be more expensive than 8000 resistors from the bay.
so that's what i'm gonna do for now, get a lifetime supply for 5 bucks of every value i need in the future :)
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andrewF
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Post by andrewF »

:lol: lets hope 8000 is a lifetime supply.
I have found my 5000 reel is already half empty.

back on topic
For me, 0805 is do-able but a PITA, much prefer 1206.
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BugBrand
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Post by BugBrand »

I recently made a kind of portable/travel components selection.
c.60 different resistor values in 0805 size - several hundred of each value..
Fits in a secure box just a bit bigger than a VHS cassette (newbies - that's like an old version youtube thingy)

SMD is much quicker to build.
But, having run some workshops teaching soldering in my time and, thus, having seen how people are often quite shakey, I can understand why SMD may appear difficult.
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L-1
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Post by L-1 »

When I made poll about my SMD soldering service, votes 'will order' and 'will not order' were 50/50.
But in reality wigglers are much lazier than voting. Most of them order SMD soldering from me.
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Post by L-1 »

I use 1206 because they can be easy soldered without any special equipment, just with thin tip and thin solder wire.
And in company with DIP chips space economy not so noticeable comparing to 0805.
(I solder with dispencer and oven of course ) :lol:
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raisinbag
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Post by raisinbag »

Hey L1 it wasn't laziness. When I chose to have you solder it was because I would have had to order the smd parts from mouser and with shipping and parts, it was cheaper to just have you supply the parts. If more projects are using smd, I think at first some people will stay away, but over time we will all start stocking our own parts, and it will just become "normal".
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L-1
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Post by L-1 »

:lol: We need more SMD projects. I campaign for 1206.

About prices. My local distributor has for $14/reel such brands as Faithful Link or Royal Ohm. They are lower quality. I buy YAGEO for $19 because Farnell has them in stock but those two - no. (it's resistors) Caps I buy Samsung or Philips.
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prinsen
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Post by prinsen »

Exactly, raisinbag. I've made the switch to almost entirely SMT (1206) myself. Once I got the technique down, and had the right tools and supplies at hand, I found it easier and faster doing SMT than doing through hole.

I'm doing a bit of teaching at the moment, making instruments using SMT with complete beginners and doing a small bit of through hole soldering as well. Someone mentioned shaky hands being an issue for some people, which is true. But for a shaky handed beginner learning traditional through hole soldering is at least as difficult as SMT is. Soldering requires both hands (one hand holding the soldering iron and the other holding the solder wire) to be relatively steady, whereas mounting an SMT component is done using just one hand.
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rosch
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Post by rosch »

not me, i always need 2 hands. i usually tin the pad and then keep the component in place with a small screwdriver while i heat up the pad. the second pad is easier then :)
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sonicwarrior
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Post by sonicwarrior »

I use a pair of tweezers to keep them in place but otherwise I do it in the same way. So far only soldered 1206 and 805 100 nF caps for CGS and Haible boards.
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Post by spotta »

rosch wrote:any tips where they are cheaper? 1000x smt 47k for example at mouser are about 53€, while i can get 1000x through hole from reichelt for 16€
what am i doing wrong?
5000 47k 0805 at Rapid £6
http://www.rapidonline.com/Electronic-C ... 00-72-0949

After doing my first smt recently on a few boards, I'd be up for it no problem. Quite easy once you have done a few.
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Post by daverj »

rosch wrote:any tips where they are cheaper? 1000x smt 47k for example at mouser are about 53€, while i can get 1000x through hole from reichelt for 16€
what am i doing wrong?
I'm not sure which ones you looked up, but I just did a search at Mouser for 47K 0805 resistors and the cheapest was a Panasonic 1% for $7 for 1000, or $20 for a reel of 5000. On Digikey they have the 5% version which is $5.44 for 1000. But 1% is better and not that much more.
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