Kicad v6 out now

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wsy
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by wsy »

Just so you have ammo when you tell $DAYJOB to ditch Solidworks and Autodesk et al...

I had a rush job -- $DAYJOB is one of the top elevator manufacturers world-wide... elevators have buttons... viruses love buttons...

"Bill, do you see the problem?" Yes" "You have one year to make this a salable product. You have no other duties but this. GO!"

Me and one minion went to work on it - KiCAD for the electronics, FreeCAD for the mechanicals and optical parts, ARDUINO IDE for the software, running on Debian Testing as an OS. 100% GPL software.

We passed FCC testing, Cal fire code, and ADA testing and had our first paying-customer install 51 weeks from "GO!"

And the product -- the PureRide Touchless Elevator just won a Best of CES Innovation award.

https://ces.tech/Innovation-Awards/Hono ... ntrol.aspx
https://us.mitsubishielectric.com/en/ne ... _en_us.pdf

When someone tells you GPL code "ain't industrial strength" tell them they are sadly misinformed.

-- Bill
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by devinw1 »

That's pretty cool Bill! Nice to hear about larger scale success stories like that.

As a looong term SW user thought, one thing I'll say is I think the allure of paying for commercial software is the support that comes with it (generally). Companies want to know that they are paying for something where if there's a problem they can call someone and get it fixed and running quickly. Of course, it's not always that cut and dry, but if you're using open source stuff, you're generally left posting to forums and hoping somebody responds if you have an issue.
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jsleeio
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by jsleeio »

I was reading about the changes in Kicad 6 yesterday. Absolutely amazed that it took them 6 major releases and TWENTY YEARS to arrive at "when I click on a thing in my schematic it is highlighted"

open source software eh
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EATyourGUITAR
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by EATyourGUITAR »

Fusion 360 crashed 3 times today in 4 hours of work. We are paying for this shit at work. Not exactly a small company. We have 6 seats for the full suite of Autodesk products. Everyone uses Autodesk inventor. I am the only one using fusion 360. It is broken. Simple as that. Retail on fusion 360 is $60 month. Altium is $1500 a year for a well equiped set of add-on options. I'm sure I could have used kicad 6 for free with more up time than paid Autodesk software. I still have persistent bugs where settings for net label xref reverts to default format after some customization. My up time is also down time.

You can use dxf or Gerber's from kicad to integrate with PCB-investigator for signal integrity, power integrity and thermal evaluation of your PCB. Kicad is really getting close to being %100 with the big boys.

What happened to GEDA PCB? Is it dead now? I don't hear anyone mentioning it anywhere. Such a shame.

BTW I tried LibrePCB on Debiun linux at work before I had them purchase my Fusion 360 license. It was an obvious eagle clone with bugs. Happy they tried but not really ready to use yet.
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gbiz
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by gbiz »

EATyourGUITAR wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:15 pm
What happened to GEDA PCB? Is it dead now? I don't hear anyone mentioning it anywhere. Such a shame.
I still use it, mostly on MacOS, sometimes on Fedora. But it's needed work to keep it running on both over the last couple of years

Some time back it refused to build for me in macports, some dependency/version issue with scheme iirc, so i ended up building most of it's toolchain & keep that in an isolated tree that won't break if i update macports. I reckoned that was less effort than switching to KiCad. I like gEDA's simplicity. Creating new symbols, footprints etc is really simple for me with gEDA.

Fedora dropped gEDA a couple of releases back, which says a lot on it's longer term future. So far, building the git repo on the current Fedora has been straighforward, so it's not an issue for me to continue with it there.

The gEDA repos are now hosted on github, a couple of people seem to be committing code, though no major new features. The PCB component got forked some time back* & they're adding new features, but files created with the new version aren't backward compatible with pcb, so theres no way back once you switch, which has put me off migrating to it.
*http://repo.hu/projects/pcb-rnd/

I've considered switching to KiCad on more that one occasion, but the workflow just looks way too complex. After the relative simplicity of gEDA the learning curve is steep. And i have a long term hatred of anything that uses KDE/WxWidgets etc.

(The comment above about Wayland, i wasn't aware of that. Thats an odd attitude. I'm surprised their major backers aren't pushing them to migrate to Wayland. Without that they'll run the risk of not having a Linux desktop with enterprise support to run it on).
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

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EATyourGUITAR wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:15 pm Fusion 360 crashed 3 times today in 4 hours of work. We are paying for this shit at work. Not exactly a small company. We have 6 seats for the full suite of Autodesk products. Everyone uses Autodesk inventor. I am the only one using fusion 360. It is broken. Simple as that. Retail on fusion 360 is $60 month. Altium is $1500 a year for a well equiped set of add-on options. I'm sure I could have used kicad 6 for free with more up time than paid Autodesk software. I still have persistent bugs where settings for net label xref reverts to default format after some customization. My up time is also down time.

You can use dxf or Gerber's from kicad to integrate with PCB-investigator for signal integrity, power integrity and thermal evaluation of your PCB. Kicad is really getting close to being %100 with the big boys.

What happened to GEDA PCB? Is it dead now? I don't hear anyone mentioning it anywhere. Such a shame.

BTW I tried LibrePCB on Debiun linux at work before I had them purchase my Fusion 360 license. It was an obvious eagle clone with bugs. Happy they tried but not really ready to use yet.
That used to be par for the course for SW back 8-10 years ago. It has gotten way better but I'm still hard-wired now to be a habitual saver because I'm afraid it's gonna go down. :D

An old coworker of my wife's is a uX designer over at the Fusion team and I met him last week at a show. I'll let him know their software is shite. :hihi:
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by adam »

there's a good flowchart in the docs which got me up and running fairly quickly

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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by joem »

adam wrote: Tue Jan 04, 2022 3:10 pm there's a good flowchart in the docs which got me up and running fairly quickly

https://docs.kicad.org/6.0/en/getting_s ... wchart.png
That flowchart seems half-finished... It goes into so much detail about the schematic and no detail at all about the PCB.

Also I always skip the netlist itself and use the toolbar button that has the schematic on one side and the PCB on the other side and an arrow between them. (Not on a computer with kicad right now so I don't know what it's called.) Is generating a netlist and then loading it better? I assumed the button I use is better since it goes straight from schematic to PCB. Is that even still possible in 6? (I really need to try it out sometime...)
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by adam »

not sure you need to generate the netlist at all in 6, think you can just press the switch to pcb view or whatever button and there it is, with a dialog box the first time you do it with errors and whatnot
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by devinw1 »

Word on the street is starting in 6 you don't generate a netlist explicity. You just hit "update PCB from schematic" in PCBnew after doing anything in EEschema
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

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devinw1 wrote: Tue Jan 04, 2022 4:34 pm Word on the street is starting in 6 you don't generate a netlist explicity. You just hit "update PCB from schematic" in PCBnew after doing anything in EEschema
That's what I've been doing in 5 ("update PCB from schematic" in PCBnew). I brought it up since it wasn't in the flowchart that was posted, so I (still using 5) was worried it was removed.
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by ericneilj »

devinw1 wrote: Tue Jan 04, 2022 4:34 pm Word on the street is starting in 6 you don't generate a netlist explicity. You just hit "update PCB from schematic" in PCBnew after doing anything in EEschema
There’s also an “update schematic from PCB” action. Very useful if you change a footprint on the PCB and want this reflected on the schematic
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cartertools
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by cartertools »

I'm just delighted that I can now do "Save As" on a project rather than manually copying and renaming the project folder.
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by marwatt »

wsy wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:32 pm Just so you have ammo when you tell $DAYJOB to ditch Solidworks and Autodesk et al...

...When someone tells you GPL code "ain't industrial strength" tell them they are sadly misinformed.

-- Bill
Great story Bill....! :yay:

btw KIKAD rulez
autodesk can die for me... (too much money wasted )
greetings - ZardoZ Il Barbaro (aka Marwatt) :eek:
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by joem »

cartertools wrote: Wed Jan 05, 2022 5:31 pm I'm just delighted that I can now do "Save As" on a project rather than manually copying and renaming the project folder.
This is amazing news! More than anything else, this is going to make me upgrade versions this weekend.
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by devinw1 »

Agree on that one. It was ridiculous you couldn't do a save as on a project previously!
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by EATyourGUITAR »

marwatt wrote: Fri Jan 07, 2022 5:49 am
wsy wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:32 pm Just so you have ammo when you tell $DAYJOB to ditch Solidworks and Autodesk et al...

...When someone tells you GPL code "ain't industrial strength" tell them they are sadly misinformed.

-- Bill
Great story Bill....! :yay:

btw KIKAD rulez
autodesk can die for me... (too much money wasted )
I just found out from the other engineers at work that Autodesk inventor also crashes. I thought it was just Fusion 360 electronics that sucked. RIP Autodesk. The hilarious thing about this is that they still have eagle available as a size limited app and it remains rock solid. Design blocks works in eagle but not fusion 360. Without the board space what is the point of design blocks anyway. All they need to do is sell eagle professional for $60 a month. They won't do it.
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jsleeio
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by jsleeio »

yup, Eagle has been really good for me too. I don't use the design blocks thing. I tried it and it didn't work for my way of getting shit done

it sounds like retooling to do what I currently do with Eagle (generate ready-to-order Eurorack front panel PCB gerbers programmatically as build artifacts from the circuit PCB board files behind them) ... in Kicad ... would be a lot of work, and I don't think it's worthwhile

I also find the Kicad community a little strange. What is the cumulative cost of so many users creating and debugging all their parts libraries from scratch because they don't trust anyone else's? It seems very weird, especially when many of the same people will argue in support of free (as in freedoms, not price) and open-source software — collaborative efforts!
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by KSS »

Making your own libraries and components is something almost everyone who uses EDA for any length of time ends up doing. Even if its only re-categorizing the available parts into usable or not.

Most parts aren't fully created from scratch -rather modified- and if you think Eagle is immune from the same issues then you're very, very lucky. Or doing something very minimal in requirements of the libraries and components.
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by EATyourGUITAR »

Most of the parts I use at work have datasheets with drawings of the parts but no recommended land pattern example. So I had to learn IPC standards to design my own land patterns. Then I had to work with the factory doing the boards to stay with the capability that they have at the cheapest price that meets my requirements. Example minimum space between pads or min pad size. I use Samac systems to find and or generate eagle footprints. If the part doesn't exist they will make it in 24 hours. There is another big company that does something similar. Go-to microchip's website if you want to check it out. Or try mouser, click the green icon for the footprint. That takes you to a third party website that is a sub contractor of the part manufacturer. You select your options and it generates the custom library on the fly.

The big problem is that KiCad may not be supported by every vendor but eagle and altium are. Samac also really sucks at symbols because it is just a box with pin numbers.
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

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EATyourGUITAR wrote: Fri Jan 07, 2022 6:38 pm ... All they need to do is sell eagle professional for $60 a month. They won't do it.
incomprehensible commercial moves ... :omg: :omg:
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by devinw1 »

Just found in Kicad 6, when you plunk down a multi unit part, it steps through all the units with just 1 mouse click. YES!
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by devinw1 »

One annoyance: In schematic view now it's very hard to move the power rails section of an IC once it's been placed. You can't seem to get it to glow all around by single clicking anywhere. Only way i can get selection is to draw a f'in box around it.

I don't know why you can't hover over something and hit "M" to move anymore... that was helpful. Kind of a roll backwards on this one IMO. :-/
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

Post by KSS »

In Diptrace this^ is solved by multiple clicks -without moving the cursor- until the desired 'layer' of the screen is selected.
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Re: Kicad v6 out now

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devinw1 wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:47 pm I don't know why you can't hover over something and hit "M" to move anymore... that was helpful. Kind of a roll backwards on this one IMO. :-/
yeah that does sound like a regression

I tend to use Eagle with one hand on the keyboard selecting commands and the other on the mouse, a good efficient way to work. So best if everything is single keys (like M)
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