Super Sixteen build support thread

Creator of of the Super Sixteen Sequencer and based in San Francisco. This is a DIY and Finished Good product for Eurorack.

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Kerplunk
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Re: Reinstall firmware?

Post by Kerplunk » Mon Mar 08, 2021 11:36 am

extralifedisco wrote:
Fri Mar 05, 2021 8:11 pm


That said, you may want to flash the firmware anyway as I have just uploaded firmware v 1.1a, which introduces some new features and fixes. You can find the hex file on github, and you will need a USB AVR programmer and the Arduino IDE (or just avrdude CLI) to install it. I will have a video up soon on how to do this procedure, I'm still editing it together now, but if you are set to go, you can find the appropriate avrdude commands here.
Hey Matthew,

just reading the above reply to izash... I'm all tooled up with a USB AVR Programmer and the Arduino IDE. But I'm confused as to what way round the connector goes on the board. I've not used one of these before, but it looks like the red stripe on the cable is connected to VCC (although it could just as easily be MISO - whatever that is :confused:) Any guidance would be most helpful...

Thanks

Image

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extralifedisco
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Re: Reinstall firmware?

Post by extralifedisco » Mon Mar 08, 2021 6:00 pm

Kerplunk wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 11:36 am

just reading the above reply to izash... I'm all tooled up with a USB AVR Programmer and the Arduino IDE. But I'm confused as to what way round the connector goes on the board. I've not used one of these before, but it looks like the red stripe on the cable is connected to VCC (although it could just as easily be MISO - whatever that is :confused:) Any guidance would be most helpful...

Thanks

Image

Hi Kerplunk,
I've just released a video tutorial on uploading the firmware! In your photo, the 5v pin (VCC) is at the bottom right. With my programmer, the cable orientation is as below:
orientation.jpg
You also need to have the module powered up via the power connector as well (unless your programmer provides power via VCC? mine doesn't).

For more details please check out the tutorial here:


Kerplunk
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Re: Reinstall firmware?

Post by Kerplunk » Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:05 am

extralifedisco wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 6:00 pm
Kerplunk wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 11:36 am

just reading the above reply to izash... I'm all tooled up with a USB AVR Programmer and the Arduino IDE. But I'm confused as to what way round the connector goes on the board. I've not used one of these before, but it looks like the red stripe on the cable is connected to VCC (although it could just as easily be MISO - whatever that is :confused:) Any guidance would be most helpful...

Thanks


Hi Kerplunk,
I've just released a video tutorial on uploading the firmware! In your photo, the 5v pin (VCC) is at the bottom right. With my programmer, the cable orientation is as below:

orientation.jpg


Sweet, nice one dude... I'll get on that later :)

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by KittenVillage » Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:13 am

KittenVillage wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 3:56 pm
I've got a weird issue with my build. When I power it up, the 16 small leds light up dimly, but I can see what I'm selecting. The two bigger leds don't seem to light up at all. I'm pretty sure I got the orientation correct on the big ones. I can't see any obvious shorts. Any advice as to where to check first?

Edit3: From the build guide: "Double-check that the LEDs are installed in the ​correct orientation​, with the short legs in the square holes on the PCB"
Fuck.

Edit 4: I've had my 15 minutes of existential despair over it. Serves me right for getting stressed over politics and then deciding to finish the build at 3am and pushing on til dawn. And then I had to wait all day for my kids to go to bed before I had the mental energy to puzzle it out. I'll pick up a proper desoldering gun and make it right next month. Still a very nice build, very solid. Cheers.
Thanks for providing an inverted LED firmware, Extralife. I took a look at the schematics, but I wanted to properly correct it. Got a desoldering gun (finally!) and had it fixed right away. I've even got the new firmware flashed.

Now to spend the next week learning how to use it!


Eurorack is an exercise in delayed desire.

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by ub1k » Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:41 pm

Hi everyone,

Maybe it's a coincidence, but since I upgraded my firmware to the latest version my Super Sixteen will randomly (every 15 minutes maybe?) switch back to program 1. It never stops playing, so it doesn't seem like a full reset of the unit, but it just chains into program 1 instead of repeating the one I'm on.
Anyone experienced the same problem?

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extralifedisco
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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by extralifedisco » Fri Mar 12, 2021 6:16 pm

ub1k wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:41 pm
Hi everyone,

Maybe it's a coincidence, but since I upgraded my firmware to the latest version my Super Sixteen will randomly (every 15 minutes maybe?) switch back to program 1. It never stops playing, so it doesn't seem like a full reset of the unit, but it just chains into program 1 instead of repeating the one I'm on.
Anyone experienced the same problem?
Wow, that's unexpected. I jammed with mine about an hour yesterday and didn't get any unexpected loops. Is it possible that the sequence you are playing has a patch number and a long number of loops selected? If you press shift+16, then turn the encoder 1 click, it will show you the current value of the "sng" and "lps" parameters. Those values are stored in an empty byte of the patch flash memory, so it's possible that incorrect data was previously written there on older patches, and now loading them up initializes it with some junk values. If you find that's the case, you can just overwrite both parameters to zero and it should stay looping on that sequence, but you may need to check your other saved patches. I tested for this and never found any junk data on my old patches but I'm wondering now if there's an edge case I messed.

Can you give any more detail about what you were doing when it jumped - letting a single sequence play, editing a sequence, loading a previous sequence, etc?

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extralifedisco
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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by extralifedisco » Fri Mar 12, 2021 6:17 pm

KittenVillage wrote:
Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:13 am
Thanks for providing an inverted LED firmware, Extralife. I took a look at the schematics, but I wanted to properly correct it. Got a desoldering gun (finally!) and had it fixed right away. I've even got the new firmware flashed.

Now to spend the next week learning how to use it!
Excellent, glad to hear it! :sb:

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by ub1k » Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:53 am

extralifedisco wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 6:16 pm
Those values are stored in an empty byte of the patch flash memory, so it's possible that incorrect data was previously written there on older patches, and now loading them up initializes it with some junk values. If you find that's the case, you can just overwrite both parameters to zero and it should stay looping on that sequence, but you may need to check your other saved patches. I tested for this and never found any junk data on my old patches but I'm wondering now if there's an edge case I messed.
Lps=76, Sng=1, I guess that explains it. It looks to me like all sequences which were initialized before the upgrade now have Lps=76. I checked a few.

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Re: Super Sixteen - Success at last (bad 4822)!

Post by izash » Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:33 am

Hi Matthew,
I received a new MCP4822 today, replaced the old one and things are looking great!
Now for learning the Super16 and making music.
Thanks for the design and support,
Izhar
izash wrote:
Wed Mar 03, 2021 3:16 pm

4. Bad IC MCP4822
Could be an ESD damage or a manufacturing defect. The rule in electronics is it's *never* a bad IC except the one time it actually is. Easy enough to replace and find out, but requires another IC of course.
[/quote]

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extralifedisco
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Re: Super Sixteen - Success at last (bad 4822)!

Post by extralifedisco » Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:11 pm

izash wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:33 am
Hi Matthew,
I received a new MCP4822 today, replaced the old one and things are looking great!
Now for learning the Super16 and making music.
Thanks for the design and support,
Izhar
Wow, great news! Such an usual error to find a half-working piece of silicon like that. I guess it happens once in a blue moon. Excellent and thorough job of troubleshooting, must have been quite frustrating to trace all that out - I congratulate you on success by sheer persistence. Cheers! :yay:

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Tue Mar 23, 2021 5:38 pm

Hi,
this could be my first "build my own partial kit", and the octopart BOM spreadsheet sure is a useful start, but...and bear with me as I am new to this, why are some of the parts not listed, or more specifically. those 17 amber LED's - what's so special about them that neither digikey, mouser, or future don't supply them? I'm hoping that I can fit whichever 3mm LED's I want to though, right?
The next problem looks like that SPI flash ship, W25Q80DVSNIG. Would be nice to get one of those within the UK, but Mouser, Digikey, Farnell and RS have them on back order or don't list them. Perhaps there is another source.....
Is this part of the fun of sourcing your own parts ;-)
Texy

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extralifedisco
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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by extralifedisco » Tue Mar 23, 2021 7:18 pm

Texy wrote:
Tue Mar 23, 2021 5:38 pm
Hi,
this could be my first "build my own partial kit", and the octopart BOM spreadsheet sure is a useful start, but...and bear with me as I am new to this, why are some of the parts not listed, or more specifically. those 17 amber LED's - what's so special about them that neither digikey, mouser, or future don't supply them? I'm hoping that I can fit whichever 3mm LED's I want to though, right?
The next problem looks like that SPI flash ship, W25Q80DVSNIG. Would be nice to get one of those within the UK, but Mouser, Digikey, Farnell and RS have them on back order or don't list them. Perhaps there is another source.....
Is this part of the fun of sourcing your own parts ;-)
Texy
Alas, a few manufacturers decided to discontinue those parts right after I put the BOM together, so I've been looking around for replacements as I use up the stock I have, and I'll update the BOM when I pick an official part.

In general, yes, you can use any LEDs with a similar voltage drop and brightness, though I'd stress that you should get diffuse lens LEDs or the module will be look pretty but be harder to use as which steps are on won't be as clearly readable from all angles.

The memory chip is pretty specific, it does need to be a winbond spiflash chip with the right footprint and 4kb sector erase. I've actually just ordered a few potential alternates and will update the BOM if one of them works properly.
- W25Q80DVSSIG - same chip with slightly wider footprint. should be drop-in the same, but might not be solderable on the existing footprint without hot air and paste
- W25Q40EWSNIG never mind, this is actually a 2.2v chip, would need a different regulator
- W25Q40CLSNIG - 4mB version of the chip, should be compatible as the memory capacity isn't close to maxed, but I want to test this myself and make sure the firmware behaves properly

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:18 am

Thanks Matthew,
I'm just going through your design/build youtube video's and itching to get started. Pease let us know the outcome of the alternate flash chips.
I'm impatient, but don't want to order any parts until I know they are all available, however I may just order the partial DIY kit from Thonk anyway before they out of stock. They don't have the full kits in now as it is - I'm not sure if they source those from yourself, or from there own suppliers.
Cheers,
Texy

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:52 pm

Difficult to find the difference between W25Q80DVSNIG and 25Q80BVSIG, but the BV parts are freely available here in the UK,
and it does meet your 4kb sector erase requirement, although I realise there is a lot more to it than that !¬

– W25Q80BV: 8M-bit/1M-byte (1,048,576)
– 256-byte per programmable page

• Flexible Architecture with 4KB sectors
– Uniform Sector Erase (4K-bytes)
– Uniform Block Erase (32K and 64K-bytes)
– Program one to 256 bytes
– Erase/Program Suspend & Resume
etc, etc

Texy

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extralifedisco
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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by extralifedisco » Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:50 pm

Texy wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:52 pm
Difficult to find the difference between W25Q80DVSNIG and 25Q80BVSIG, but the BV parts are freely available here in the UK,
and it does meet your 4kb sector erase requirement, although I realise there is a lot more to it than that !¬

– W25Q80BV: 8M-bit/1M-byte (1,048,576)
– 256-byte per programmable page

Texy
Interesting, I had originally spec'd a BV chip because they made it in DIP-8, but I think manufacturers are just selling their old stock, because Winbond officially discontinued that chip in 2014. DV is supposedly a drop-in replacement, but if you can get the W25Q80BV in SOIC-8 narrow footprint (SNIG) then by all means go for it.

Here's the part obsolescence notice from winbond, specifying they're equivalent:
https://media.digikey.com/pdf/PCNs/Winb ... TSdate.pdf

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Wed Mar 24, 2021 5:54 pm

...well specifically they are 25Q80BVSIG , so I'm not sure they are narrow SOIC's, but the photo does look its the same footprint. I'm gonna take a punt - I can always bend the legs if necessary.
Thanks
Texy

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Re: Super Sixteen - Success at last (bad 4822)!

Post by izash » Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:08 pm

Thank you Matthew!
This process made me appreciate the S16 much more and it is now a much more personal piece of music making gear.
Looking forward to your next product.
Izhar
extralifedisco wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:11 pm
izash wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:33 am
Hi Matthew,
I received a new MCP4822 today, replaced the old one and things are looking great!
Now for learning the Super16 and making music.
Thanks for the design and support,
Izhar
Wow, great news! Such an usual error to find a half-working piece of silicon like that. I guess it happens once in a blue moon. Excellent and thorough job of troubleshooting, must have been quite frustrating to trace all that out - I congratulate you on success by sheer persistence. Cheers! :yay:

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:08 am

Hi,
well I've had some 'fun' sourcing the parts for this build, mainly because I want to be able to purchase everything within the UK.
I've struggled with the tactile switch caps, so decided to go for switches with a longer button shaft :
switch.jpg
The shaft is 9.4mm high - hopefully this is long enough to go through the panel, do you think ?

I've been able to source most parts from Farnell, but I went to eBay for the flash memory (25Q80BVSIG), 3mm / 5mm LED's and triple 7-segment display, and to Thonk for the pots /caps, 3.5mm jacks sockets, and the pcb/panel set.

Texy

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:12 am

Also I already had a load of headers in one of my many EE parts boxes :
IMG_7838.jpg
Again, I'm hoping they will be suitable, once cut to the correct pin-count. I may need to experiment a little if they are either too high, or too low mechanically....
Texy

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by My_one_opus » Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:13 am

I got everything from Tayda and Digikey and shipped to UK without any issues; any reason you’ve avoided non-UK suppliers?

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:26 am

My_one_opus wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:13 am
I got everything from Tayda and Digikey and shipped to UK without any issues; any reason you’ve avoided non-UK suppliers?
Mainly for 2 reasons - delay in getting the parts, potential additional customs charges. Even though I have just started my eurorack journey and the only items I have so far are a rack with uZeus power panel, and some patch cables, lol.
So out of interest, did you encounter any charges, and how long did it take to get here, assuming it was recently, as if it was pre-brexit, things could be different now...
Texy

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by My_one_opus » Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:40 am

Digikey/Mouser orders usually arrive within a week of ordering, all customs and VAT are pre-paid so no additional charges. They have been taking a bit longer to ship in the last few months with covid/snow issues going on, but they still arrive ~3 working days after shipping so barely any slower than CPC/RS/Farnell. Tayda has been fine, I’ve had no charges when shipping by the cheap registered post option, including post-brexit and $50+ worth; but they do take 3/4 weeks to arrive, so there’s the trade off vs cost.

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by extralifedisco » Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:25 am

Texy wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:08 am
Hi,
well I've had some 'fun' sourcing the parts for this build, mainly because I want to be able to purchase everything within the UK.
I've struggled with the tactile switch caps, so decided to go for switches with a longer button shaft :
switch.jpg
The shaft is 9.4mm high - hopefully this is long enough to go through the panel, do you think ?

I've been able to source most parts from Farnell, but I went to eBay for the flash memory (25Q80BVSIG), 3mm / 5mm LED's and triple 7-segment display, and to Thonk for the pots /caps, 3.5mm jacks sockets, and the pcb/panel set.

Texy

Sounds like a plan. For the tact switches, near as I can measure, the distance from the top of the button body to the front of the panel is 7.7mm, so add the 1.4mm panel thickness and the buttons should sit almost flush with the panel. They may be usable but I used similar switches on an early prototype and didn't find them very comfortable to use. The button cutouts are also probably wider than the plunger shafts so they may wiggle a lot in the cutouts. If you find that to be the case, you could always add some switch caps to those buttons - they make generic round caps that fit those plungers.

If you go that route, you may need to drill out the the panel cutouts to fit larger button caps. This shouldn't be a problem, but I strongly suggest screwing down the panel to a piece of scrap wood and using a drill press rather than a hand drill to avoid damaging the panel or your hands.

In general, I would just suggest doing a dry fit of the potentiometers, switches, encoder, and hex standoff so that you can try out the buttons before you solder them, that way you can make a decision about whether the fit works for you without being locked into it.

Also, on the seven segment display - kingbright makes similar models in common anode / common cathode / discrete digit pinouts, so be sure yours is common anode.

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:48 am

Thanks again Matthew.
I'm aware the switch buttons shafts are smaller than the panel holes and may wiggle, but I thought the length would be ok, shame. As you say, there are button caps available for those round shafts, so adding those is an idea. I may even try 3D printing some off ;-)
The 7 seg display is the actual part specified in the BOM, Kingbright BA56-12GWA, so should be good.
Cheers,
Texy

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Re: Super Sixteen build support thread

Post by Texy » Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:51 pm

Annoyed with myself !
I ordered two lines of 2N2904's instead of ordering some 2N2906's. So I've ordered some from eBay.
I also got my pcb + panel & Atmel chip from Thonk today, forgetting that it also included the grey tact switch button caps.
Of course they need to go with square switch shafts, not round ones. I found the 'standard' button caps that I ordered to
go with my 9mm high round shafted buttons are slightly too wide to go through the panel holes. So I've also now ordered
some square shafted tact buttons from eBay as well. I have now spent more on parts than if I had (been able to) ordered the
complete DIY kit from Thonk. Ah well, all part of the 'fun' as I mentioned previously.
Texy

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