XOR electronics NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:29 am

Fyde wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:22 am
Hello everyone,
I'm looking for a deep sequencer with good recording capabilities, I'm considering the Nerdseq and the Hermod but regarding the Nerdseq I can't find information about a few things that I need.
Is it possible to record multiple modulation sources other than CV and GATE? For example I'm planning to also record the pressure CV from the Doboz TSNM mkII. I watched a video showing the recording process with the CV expander but it's not clear if it's only for polyphony or also for modulation.
I know that the CV would only fit in the tracker's rows so it wouldn't have a high resolution but I was hoping to use the glide function to smooth things out, how well does that work?
I'm leaning slightly towards the Hermod because it has dedicated velocity and aftertouch tracks so it would be perfect for this, but I really love how deep the Nerdseq is so I'm really trying to make this work lol
You can also record modulations into the modular tracks. And this you can smooth out indeed with the glide functions. You just have to be aware that the CV inputs only allow 0 to 10 Volt, so it is not a bipolar input. However the outputs can be bipolar.

It is for sure not the perfect CV recorder because just as you mentioned already, it can only record into the steps.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by Fyde » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:15 am

firestARTer wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:29 am
You can also record modulations into the modular tracks. And this you can smooth out indeed with the glide functions. You just have to be aware that the CV inputs only allow 0 to 10 Volt, so it is not a bipolar input. However the outputs can be bipolar.

It is for sure not the perfect CV recorder because just as you mentioned already, it can only record into the steps.
Very helpful, thank you!

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by kriskeyman » Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:37 pm

Is it possible to limit note entry for a pattern to a specific scale? I’ve set up a table with the specific notes, but this seems to only limit what gets played back. I’m looking to limit notes while creating the pattern.

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by megarat » Tue Jun 22, 2021 8:16 pm

The NerdSEQ “More Video-IO” is now up on MG.

“Coming very soon...”

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by petejm » Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:44 am

megarat wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 8:16 pm
The NerdSEQ “More Video-IO” is now up on MG.

“Coming very soon...”
Interesting, it says the USB port is primarily for attaching a PC keyboard but it would be great if it also supported a USB MIDI keyboard, e.g. Korg's microKEY 25.

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:48 am

petejm wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:44 am
megarat wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 8:16 pm
The NerdSEQ “More Video-IO” is now up on MG.

“Coming very soon...”
Interesting, it says the USB port is primarily for attaching a PC keyboard but it would be great if it also supported a USB MIDI keyboard, e.g. Korg's microKEY 25.
That's for the USB Midi expander. This is a different module and will most probably not support it.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by petejm » Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:54 am

firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:48 am
petejm wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:44 am
Interesting, it says the USB port is primarily for attaching a PC keyboard but it would be great if it also supported a USB MIDI keyboard, e.g. Korg's microKEY 25.
That's for the USB Midi expander. This is a different module and will most probably not support it.
Oh lovely, I didn't know that was in the works, is it too cheeky to get a rough ETA for that? :party:

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:58 am

petejm wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:54 am
firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:48 am
petejm wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:44 am
Interesting, it says the USB port is primarily for attaching a PC keyboard but it would be great if it also supported a USB MIDI keyboard, e.g. Korg's microKEY 25.
That's for the USB Midi expander. This is a different module and will most probably not support it.
Oh lovely, I didn't know that was in the works, is it too cheeky to get a rough ETA for that? :party:
Too cheeky, yes :-)

After this I will continue working on this. The hardware is already in production. Just hope there are no issues on the way because of the silicon crisis, but I think it should be fine. I prepared critical components on an early stage. It will have a USB-Host, USB-Device, TRS-A Midi ports and two I2C ports and something more. All that also on 6HP. I expect autumn/winter for it.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by petejm » Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:07 am

firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:58 am
petejm wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:54 am
firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:48 am
petejm wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:44 am
Interesting, it says the USB port is primarily for attaching a PC keyboard but it would be great if it also supported a USB MIDI keyboard, e.g. Korg's microKEY 25.
That's for the USB Midi expander. This is a different module and will most probably not support it.
Oh lovely, I didn't know that was in the works, is it too cheeky to get a rough ETA for that? :party:
Too cheeky, yes :-)

After this I will continue working on this. The hardware is already in production. Just hope there are no issues on the way because of the silicon crisis, but I think it should be fine. I prepared critical components on an early stage. It will have a USB-Host, USB-Device, TRS-A Midi ports and two I2C ports and something more. All that also on 6HP. I expect autumn/winter for it.
Oh wow, sounds great, lots of stuff packed in there! I'll put my special piggy bank out for this :hyper:

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by ch3oh » Fri Jun 25, 2021 12:55 am

Would it be possible to let the new random ranges feature operate in a relative mode rather than providing absolute values? Like if I set the note to C-5 and then subsequently pick the ±10% random range, the C-5 would act as an offset for the randomization. I think this would greatly increase its flexibility. Or maybe there is some clever way of doing this already?

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by Kr0nus » Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:18 pm

Just FYI for anyone awaiting the More Video-IO expander, it appears they are now available from the XOR shop, I just grabbed one:
https://xor-electronics.com/product/ner ... der-black/
https://xor-electronics.com/product/ner ... nder-grey/
https://xor-electronics.com/product/ner ... rey-black/

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by Dusty Patches » Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:50 pm

Thanks for the heads up, just grabbed one!

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed Jul 07, 2021 6:55 am

The documentation is extensive so even though I looked, I didn't manage to find the information I'm looking for:

What kind of meta parameters can I control using the 4 CV inputs and MIDI? Can I control things like track mutes on/off, play next pattern on track, move to next island, start stop pattern, next patch, etc? Generally speaking "meta" would be controlling the sequencer page, as in higher level parameters.

Also firestARTer are there any plans to have the i2c functionality on the Nerdseq act as a slave? My plan is to combine it with Teletype, and as you can imagine, it would be ideal if I can send i2c message to control parameters on the Nerdseq since the Teletype is better at higher level things.

Thank you for any answers, I'm about to buy one and it seems the combination of these two modules would be extremely powerful. My current plan is to combine things in this particular order: Teletype > i2c2midi > Melisma > Nerdseq > BitBox Micro. These modules are beyond powerful but the only thing combining them is MIDI. I haven't found a dedicated MIDI page on the manual, is there a consolidated document of what can be controlled by MIDI on the Nerdseq (apart from inputting notes and recording incoming MIDI Notes, etc)?
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by megarat » Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:18 am

Paranormal Patroler wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 6:55 am
What kind of meta parameters can I control using the 4 CV inputs and MIDI? Can I control things like track mutes on/off, play next pattern on track, move to next island, start stop pattern, next patch, etc? Generally speaking "meta" would be controlling the sequencer page, as in higher level parameters.
Have you looked at pages 102-103 of the manual, where the CVable features are described? Some additional recording- and MIDI-based features are described on pages 104 and onwards.

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:38 am

As for now these are the things to control trough the CV inputs:
Gate, CV voltages to record or play. Transposing track. Select X/Y patterns on the sequencer screen to start/stop them. Trigger/Select samples.
Gate/Trigger envelopes, use as automator input which can be routed then to mnay functions directly (like probabilities,glide, trigger lenghts...) and indirect to all possible functions in a track. Use as modulation input for LFO speeds...and so on...
The Midi input currently supports only the record functions with the mod wheel/velocity. A extensive CC input routing table is planned but not implemented by now. But you could simply like manipulate one of the mod outputs and patch to a CV input to get more functionality here.

As for I2C, indeed it will have 2 I2C ports which can be set to be leader or follower. I don't really know yet about the follower functions, but I just got Befacos VCMC which can also generate I2C and I am sure there will be a deep implementation for it at some point. (Midi CC first, but the rest will follow). One Idea is also to have a pass through mode, so a faderbank could be passed through the NerdSEQ to like the ER301 together with NerdSEQ generated Data. I say ER301 here but of course other gear will work with it, too. The most follow the basic teletype protocol as far as I know.
I will get deeper with it when it's the next task here.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by RolandoBlanca » Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:31 am

OK I finally pretty much cracked getting decent recordings of sequences from Intellijel Metropolix via recording "CV NOTE + TRIGGER 1", it does still seem like changing the gate lengths isn't being recorded (well, I am guessing in this mode a fixed trigger is recorded, regardless of the gate length coming in?) but the resulting recorded sequences in the nerdseq are now very close. I found in CV NOTE + GATE recording mode that multi-tap stages on Metropolix (where the step outputs multiple gates) would record as FE (note on), then the next gate would record as FE on the following step of the nerdseq sequence and so on, so you ended up with a constantly open envelope.

Does anyone know how to do this better? I know I could edit the triggers (or perhaps change the default) but the ideal would be to record the gates from Metropolix directly, but I am guessing the NerdSeq can only record at step resolution, so it records the "Note On" on one step, and unless the following step is a rest it will never get a step in which to put a [] - have I guessed right?

In that case, the only workaround I could think of would be to run the nerdseq at a faster clock rate, say 240bpm, then run the metropolix at a half clock from that, which sounds like it could/maybe/might work to get a pulse on metropolix to be followed by a rest at the resolution of the Nerdseq with the higher clock rate, but would be a pretty massive hack. Is there a better way to do this?

Also, when recording, it seems I can only overdub, so say I started with a 4-on-the-floor beat coming from metropolix, then swung it whilst recording (without changing the number of active steps, just moving them in swing), I would eventually end up filling all the steps in the pattern - so I would have beats on every step, not just the newly swung 4 beats. I have looked carefully in the manual but have been unable to find anything about this - how do I overwrite when recording instead of overdubbing?

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:36 am

megarat wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:18 am
Have you looked at pages 102-103 of the manual, where the CVable features are described? Some additional recording- and MIDI-based features are described on pages 104 and onwards.
Thanks for the pointer, I'll take a look. ;)
firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:38 am
I don't really know yet about the follower functions, but I just got Befacos VCMC which can also generate I2C and I am sure there will be a deep implementation for it at some point. (Midi CC first, but the rest will follow). One Idea is also to have a pass through mode, so a faderbank could be passed through the NerdSEQ to like the ER301 together with NerdSEQ generated Data. I say ER301 here but of course other gear will work with it, too.
I work with Befaco on the VCMC/CV Thing i2c firmware. Last I remember (it's been a while) the follower option is not readily available yet, so it can't be used with Teletype or other leaders. Funny you should mention as I have the VCMC and CV Thing on the very same case where the Nerdseq is going! So to my ears Nerdseq <> VCMC communication sounds like a lovely prospect, whenever it comes. Now I'm even more excited!

I'm happy to help you with information on operators (henceforth called ops) that the Teletype uses to control other modules via i2c. Typically, there are dedicated ops for i2c capable modules but I'm unsure if at this stage there would be a possibility to add dedicated Nerdseq ops; it might be a possibility if there's enough demand. That being said, lately, especially for MIDI, there are generic MIDI ops as well as ops for modules such as the Disting EX which are pretty wide-ranging so maybe those could act as stand ins for Nerdseq <> Teletype communication in the future. Happy to bring you in contact with the responsible parties. CC should also suffice if the i2c follower option never materializes.

Isn't Nerdseq already capable of just passing through incoming MIDI data on non-assigned channels? I would assume that's the case when using the MIDI input, or where you referring to i2c pass through?
firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:38 am
The most follow the basic teletype protocol as far as I know.
I will get deeper with it when it's the next task here.
Yes, if I'm not mistaken Teletype was the module that originated the i2c protocol use in Eurorack modules, so any/most manufacturers that use it have some connectivity with Monome modules in mind. FYI it is open hardware so you could easily build one for yourself in order to try Nerdseq <> Teletype integration. Anyway, there is no rush, obviously, I'm just happy to hear i2c expansion is in the roadmap. I'm very keen on getting the i2c/USB board you're making, seems like a useful module, right after the 2hp TRS-A expander.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:41 am

RolandoBlanca wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:31 am
OK I finally pretty much cracked getting decent recordings of sequences from Intellijel Metropolix via recording "CV NOTE + TRIGGER 1", it does still seem like changing the gate lengths isn't being recorded (well, I am guessing in this mode a fixed trigger is recorded, regardless of the gate length coming in?) but the resulting recorded sequences in the nerdseq are now very close. I found in CV NOTE + GATE recording mode that multi-tap stages on Metropolix (where the step outputs multiple gates) would record as FE (note on), then the next gate would record as FE on the following step of the nerdseq sequence and so on, so you ended up with a constantly open envelope.

Does anyone know how to do this better? I know I could edit the triggers (or perhaps change the default) but the ideal would be to record the gates from Metropolix directly, but I am guessing the NerdSeq can only record at step resolution, so it records the "Note On" on one step, and unless the following step is a rest it will never get a step in which to put a [] - have I guessed right?

In that case, the only workaround I could think of would be to run the nerdseq at a faster clock rate, say 240bpm, then run the metropolix at a half clock from that, which sounds like it could/maybe/might work to get a pulse on metropolix to be followed by a rest at the resolution of the Nerdseq with the higher clock rate, but would be a pretty massive hack. Is there a better way to do this?

Also, when recording, it seems I can only overdub, so say I started with a 4-on-the-floor beat coming from metropolix, then swung it whilst recording (without changing the number of active steps, just moving them in swing), I would eventually end up filling all the steps in the pattern - so I would have beats on every step, not just the newly swung 4 beats. I have looked carefully in the manual but have been unable to find anything about this - how do I overwrite when recording instead of overdubbing?
This is what it does. If you set it to record triggers it will fill in triggers. If it is set to record gates then it will record gate on and off. This only into the steps as this is the resoultion of the sequencer.
It is not a CV recorder or something like this. It will always only record and quantize what possible into the steps. Doubles or triplets are indeed not detected.

Hold the table button and it will remove the field just before recording.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by RolandoBlanca » Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:55 am

firestARTer wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:41 am
This is what it does. If you set it to record triggers it will fill in triggers. If it is set to record gates then it will record gate on and off. This only into the steps as this is the resoultion of the sequencer.
It is not a CV recorder or something like this. It will always only record and quantize what possible into the steps. Doubles or triplets are indeed not detected.

Hold the table button and it will remove the field just before recording.
Thanks, I'll give it a try now.

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Wed Jul 07, 2021 12:36 pm

Paranormal Patroler wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:36 am

Yes, if I'm not mistaken Teletype was the module that originated the i2c protocol use in Eurorack modules, so any/most manufacturers that use it have some connectivity with Monome modules in mind. FYI it is open hardware so you could easily build one for yourself in order to try Nerdseq <> Teletype integration. Anyway, there is no rush, obviously, I'm just happy to hear i2c expansion is in the roadmap. I'm very keen on getting the i2c/USB board you're making, seems like a useful module, right after the 2hp TRS-A expander.
Yes, I know that the VCMC I2C integration is more like a stub at the moment. But I checked the source already and this is all working out well once I continue with it. ( I want to use it, too, so I most probably will contribute also to the VCMC dev).
I meant actually I2C pass through. Like that fader thing -> NerdSEQ -> ER301. So all 3 can be used. The NerdSEQ Midi itself doesn't have a thru mode but routes is a track is set to midi the input for the channel through it (and possibly also changes the channels/offsets etc if applicated).
I got the I2C leader part to control the ER301 part already running with the most important units ( I think it was pitch, trigger/gate and another thing), and it is quite easy. Of course I will not add the complete teletype I2C stack but keep it to the necessary for nearly everyone. We got to see how far I will go with it, in the end this is for just a handfull of people.
I would love to try out the teletype one day...but I really got no time for it and I doubt I will have in the near future. If, then it is only to test stuff.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by kriskeyman » Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:09 pm

Is it possible to limit note entry for a pattern to a specific scale? I’ve set up a table with the specific notes, but this seems to only limit what gets played back. I’m looking to limit while entering notes to create a pattern.

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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by firestARTer » Thu Jul 08, 2021 12:28 am

kriskeyman wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:09 pm
Is it possible to limit note entry for a pattern to a specific scale? I’ve set up a table with the specific notes, but this seems to only limit what gets played back. I’m looking to limit while entering notes to create a pattern.
Not possible currently but planned. Look on the thread about it in the XOR Forum for more information.
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Re: Nerdsynth NerdSEQ - eurorack tracker/sampler

Post by kriskeyman » Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:36 am

firestARTer wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 12:28 am
kriskeyman wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:09 pm
Is it possible to limit note entry for a pattern to a specific scale? I’ve set up a table with the specific notes, but this seems to only limit what gets played back. I’m looking to limit while entering notes to create a pattern.
Not possible currently but planned. Look on the thread about it in the XOR Forum for more information.
Wonderful to hear! Thank you, I’ll check it out!

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Re:

Post by Paranormal Patroler » Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:39 am

firestARTer wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:24 pm
Ceres wrote:From what I understand, the groove parameter controls the individual step length, so effectively you could have 1/4 or 1/8 notes. Is there a table that shows what each hex designation would mean in the context of a whole note or some kind of visual representation of how the groove breaks down the length of a step?
Don't confuse steplength with gatelength here. (If you do)
While the groove parameter can indeed control the steplength for each step (on each track) independently. The Gate can be set and reset on every step of course, but also everything in between from way shorter than the step it's being set to, to endless long and everything in between.
There isn't enough information about the Groove on the manual. I've watched the videos, I get the concept, but I haven't seen a table that explains how the different numbers on the Groove translate to different step lengths. Mind you, I'm not talking about Gate length, so let's not talk about gates at all; I want to verify that I can reliably change the step length of specific steps on a pattern using Groove and that it isn't limited to swing.
Screenshot_2.png
From what I understand, and based on that it seems reasonable to presume that 6 is the number of ticks for a 16th note (since 24ppqn is the standard clock for MIDI and the required external clock so that Nerdseq runs best), is it correct that in order to retain the 64 steps per pattern, the largest note value I can have in the patter is quarter note (at 24 ticks) ?

If I needed larger notes (half notes, full notes), I'd have to "merge" a few steps into a larger note and thus "lose" the option to add 64 individual steps/events. Correct?

And generally speaking, a pattern is 64 x 16th notes, so it a Nerdseq pattern runs at 16/4 when no BRK is utilized (I'm not taking Tables into account here) and if the default Groove is at 6. Correct?

Just trying to understand how the available values translate to common notation values. Speaking of tables, those allow for smaller division of the 16th note, so it's easy to add trills, tuplets, etc, but without utilizing those you can get 32nd notes and somewhere close to 64ths. Correct? Again, not talking about gates at all, just focusing on what steps on a single pattern do.



EDIT

There's also clock division per track which would allow for larger values, but again, trying to focus on a per pattern level.
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Re: Re:

Post by firestARTer » Thu Jul 08, 2021 3:42 am

Exactly, the NerdSEQ runs at 24ppqn internally which would mean 6 equal ticks per step. 4 step would usually be a full note (if you set the gate and/or change the note on the first step and stop it after the 4th step) if the groove is all set to 6. Half a note would be set on the first, reset after the 2nd etc.. Quarter note would be just on one step. Longer notes...just as you want, you can create the notelengths like you want to and they are no real limits. Shorter notes would indeed utilize either half gates or with the tables and there you could create even shorter notes/gates.
From what I understand, and based on that it seems reasonable to presume that 6 is the number of ticks for a 16th note (since 24ppqn is the standard clock for MIDI and the required external clock so that Nerdseq runs best), is it correct that in order to retain the 64 steps per pattern, the largest note value I can have in the patter is quarter note (at 24 ticks) ?
No the largest note value can be infinite.
If I needed larger notes (half notes, full notes), I'd have to "merge" a few steps into a larger note and thus "lose" the option to add 64 individual steps/events. Correct?
No, you just say on one step to change/start the note and on whatever other step you stop the note (which means stop the gate for CV/Gate tracks).
You don't lose anything. And in between you can manipulate this started (long) note in many ways on every step and even deeper within 1/6th step (using the tables) or dynamically (using the automators).
And generally speaking, a pattern is 64 x 16th notes, so it a Nerdseq pattern runs at 16/4 when no BRK is utilized (I'm not taking Tables into account here) and if the default Groove is at 6. Correct?
Yes 64 steps of 1/4 notes in the most basic way if groove is set to 6. Patternlengths can be changed as well as using BRK commands. And if you chain the patterns (= doing a simple arrangement in the sequencer screen) you can get much longer sequences. You can change your own default groove which is set then for new patterns.
Just trying to understand how the available values translate to common notation values. Speaking of tables, those allow for smaller division of the 16th note, so it's easy to add trills, tuplets, etc, but without utilizing those you can get 32nd notes and somewhere close to 64ths. Correct? Again, not talking about gates at all, just focusing on what steps on a single pattern do.
Yes, if the table is connected to the internal tick base, then you could get 1/6th of a quart note resolution. (And since you say notes...all of this applies also to any other functions/effects)
You can use the tables to create duplets or triplets or very odd stuff. You could much easier if talking about gates/triggers using the ratcheting functions which allows to get a ratchet of up to 8 for a step, also with some odd ratchets here. You could combine both....

What I want to say basically, the groove settings are indeed interresting if you want to create odd stuff, uneven patterns that are not only uneven by steps etc...but mainly and probably for most people keeping it at 6 is how it's being used. And all the functions together can give you much more possibilities (and might also add much more complexity, so it can get very difficult to understand whats happening).
NerdSEQ - one of the most advanced Eurorack Sequencers
https://www.xor-electronics.com

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